( THE LONDON MAGAZINE. JANUARY, 1744. JOURNAL of the PROCEEDINGS and DEBATES in the POLITICAL CLUB, continued from the Appendix, 1743. Conclufion of the SPEECH of M. Agrippa, in the Character of Lord Carteret, begun in our Appendix to laft Year, p. 659, in the DEBATÉ relating to the Spirituous Liquors Bill. M Y Lords, tho' A the Duties are not by this Bill raifed fo high as they afterwards may, and ought to be, yet I cannot grant, B that the Liquors will come as good and as cheap to the Confumers as formerly, or that the Distillers and Retailers either will, or can bear the whole Burden of the Duty. The Duty, 'tis true, to Appearance, is but fall, and must be C thought fo by your Lordships who have fuch opulent Fortunes; but if we confider the Price of the Com modity, and the Circumftances of the Purchasers, the Duty muft be thought very high. The Duty is 6d. a Gallon, and the Commodity is but 18d. or 25. a Gallon at moft and I cannot think, that a Duty equal to one 'Third or one Fourth of the Manufacturer's Price, can properly be faid to be a fmall Duty. As the diftilling Trade has been a ftanding Trade for many Years, without any Reftraint or Monopoly, we muft fuppofe, they now fell as cheap to the Retailer as they can poffibly afford, confequently they must fell dearer or make their Liquors worse. If they make them worse, the Con: fumers will not purchase them at any Rate, and therefore they must fell them dearer. Suppofe they add exactly the Duty, and no more, to the Price they formerly fold at: Sixpence a Gallon is three Farthings a Pint, 1744 A Pint, fuppofing the Retailer fhould As to the Accefs, my Lords, if C even Gin itself will be to be had no where but at the better Sort of Alehoufes. This I take to be the principal Advantage propofed to be got by this Bill: It will take the Trade out of the Hands of thofe, who, by E being below, fet themfelves above the Law; because it will furnish the Government with a Set of reputable Perfons, whofe Business it will be to inform againft, and profecute fuch illegal and fcandalous Dealers; whereas at prefent no Man will be at the F trouble to inform, because there is nothing to be got by the Inforniation. Thus the Bill will bring the Trade under fome Regulation, by confining it to thofe, who have fome Credit, and live comfortably by their Bufi nefs. Such Perfons will be afraid to G admit of great Abufes or Debauches, left it should occafion their Licence to be taken from them; for as the Juftices of Peace have a Power, they may, and, I hope, will withdraw their Licence, as foon as they are informed, that the Perfon licenfed makes a bad Use of it. Having acknowledged, my Lords, that the Duties now propofed are not fo high as they ought to be, I fhall endeavour to account for this Defect. My Lords, this Bill is and was at firft defigned but as an Experiment: You may increase the Duties next Seffion of Parliament, if you then. think proper; but it was thought dangerous to raise them very high all at once, left it might have occafion'd the Continuance of the illegal and clandeftine Way of felling Gin, which is now fo frequent, and left the Multitude of Profecutions thereby occafioned, might have revived that Spirit among the Populace, which appeared fo violent against the Execution of the Law now in Being; for where the Profits to be made by Smuggling are very confiderable, many will run the Rifk, let the Penalties be never fo fevere, or the Danger never fo great, as appears at prefent in the Cafe of Wool, French Brandies, and Tea. This, I think, was a prudent Caution at the Beginning, but will not be fo neceffary in a Year or two; because all thofe, who now live by the clandeftine felling of Spirituous Liquors, will in that Time have either taken out Licences, or will be got into fome other Way of Living, and will not be fo apt to re-affume the Trade, as they would now be to continue it. Therefore as the Duties cannot, with any Prudence, be raifed higher at firft, we have at prefent no Occafion to examine Distillers or Retailers, as to the Height they may be raised to hereafter. In short, my Lords, this Bill, if paffed ino a Law, will certainly, in my Opinion, have fome Effect as to the reftraining of the Vice complain'd of; and it is attended with this Advantage, that it puts you into a Way, by by which you may, by Degrees, reftrain it as much as it can be by any human Law or Power; but this is not to be done all at once, nor can it, I am afraid, be ever done altogether. Some People will follow it ought to do of every other Lux- their Inclinations, tho' they know A you have proper Laws for that Pur-, pofe; for furely you will not abfoAlutely prohibit what is in itself innocent, often useful, and fometimes neceffary, for the fake of preventing a vicious Abuse of it; especially as the Manufacture fupports great Numbers of your People, and the Commodity fome valuable Branches of your Com Death to be the certain Confequence. I have heard of a Gentleman, who being dangerously ill of a Dropfy, fent for a Phyfician. When the Phyfician came, he found the Gentleman with a Pot of Liquor upon his Table; and afking the Gentleman what B it was? A Pot of Fine Ale, fays he, with Toaft and Nutmeg. The Phyfician immediately faid, Sir, you must not touch it: It is certain Death for a Man in your Condition. Not touch it, Doctor! replies the Gentleman: Why, if my Grave were on C this Hand, and that Pot of Ale on the other,,I would drink it, were I fure of being thrown into my Grave next Moment. This, my Lords, is a fingle Inftance of the perverfe Will of fome People; but the whole Country of D Ireland, at least the common People there, may be brought as an Inftance of the fame Kind: They have in that Country a Spirituous Liquor called Sheepey, which by many Experiments has been found to be perfect Poifon; for which Reason ftrict Laws E have been enacted against it, and severe Punishments inflicted upon those that diftil or retail it; yet as it intoxicates, and may be had cheap, tho' the People know how pernicious it is, they will drink it, and in fpite of all the Government can do, they fall upon Ways and Means to get it. Our Gin is not of fuch a pernicious Nature as this Irish Liquor: If drank moderately, it may fometimes be of Service: Like all other ftrong Liquors, the Vice confifts in the Excefs: But as it is a Sort of Luxury, G even when it is not drunk to Excefs, why should not the Government a`vail itself of this Luxury, as well as F merce. Having thus fhewn, my Lords, A 2 might be alledged, that a Man could not to much as give a Dram to his Friend without incurring the Penalty, and from hence any one, even of your Lordships, might be convicted, and made liable to the Penalty of retailing Spirituous Liquors, in a lefs A Quantity than two Gallons, without Licence. a have agreed to lend the neceffary Sums upon it at Three per Cent. We cannot depend upon having the Money upon any new Fund, at the fame Interest. It may in the mean Time rife, to fix or seven per Cent. This very Jumble in our Affairs may be the Cause of its rifing to that Height; for Credit, publick as well as private, is a most ticklish Thing to be dally'd with. It often evanishes without any apparent Cause, and is fometimes hurt by Accidents, B which in themselves appear to be of little or no Confequence. Therefore, I must give it as my Opinion, that if your Lordships have a juft Regard either to the Liberties or the Credit of your Country, you will proceed in your Committee upon this Bill, C and go thro' it without any Amendment; for the prefent State of foreign Affairs requires the utmost Difpatch: Nay, the leaft Demur in providing for the Supplies of this critical enfuing Year, might fo much difconcert his Majefty's Negotiations abroad, might fo long delay his being able to refolve upon any for his future Conduct, and so much retard his Preparations at home, that the Seafon for giving Relief might be irrecoverably loft; and if fuch a fatal Difappointment should happen, I hope, the Misfortunes the Nation may be thereby exposed to, will not be laid at the Door of any of his Majefty's Minifters. These two dangerous Laws we are, my Lords, to get free from by this Bill, if paffed into a Law, and this, I hope, will be an Argument of fome Weight in its Favour; but the chief Argument is its being already paffed, and defigned by the ather Houfe as the Method for raifing a great Part of the Supplies for the enfuing Year. This, I hope, will be an Argument not only for your Lordships paffing this Bill, but for your paffing it without AmendIment. I am as much against your giving up your Power of amending Money Bills as any Lord can be; but at the prefent Conjuncture, when the Affairs abroad are in fuch a ticklih Situation; when they require D the most speedy and the moft ftrenuous Interpofition of this Nation, it would be the Height of Imprudence, if not Madness, to try Experiments with the other Houfe. A Trial of this Kind might breed fuch a Contest between the two Houfes, as would put a full Stop to the Wheels of our Government, when the Liberties of Europe, and confequently our own, require its acting with the greateft Energy as well as Free dom. I shall grant, my Lords, that if this Bill were rejected, some other Method might be contriv'd for raising the necefiary Supplies: We are not as yet, thank God! fo much reduced as to have but one Refource. I hope, our Enemies will find to their Cot, that we have as yet a great many. But let us confider, that this Fund has already been propofed, to our money'd Men; and they E F Scheme C. Helvius, in the Character of the late Lord Hervey, food up next 2 and spoke in Substance thus. My Lords, T HE noble Lords, who are Advocates for this Bill, may acknowledge the Evils produced by the drinking of Spirituous Liquors; but Gto thofe who view the Bill in the. fame Light with me, they must appear to have very little Concern about them; and, therefore, may pro perly |