to judge from the few appeals which came up from Ireland, no great evil could exist in the administration of justice in that kingdom; but, unhappily, the question was not as to the administration of justice there between rich and rich, but between the rich and the poor. The evil complained of, arose not out of the administration of the law by the judges, but by the magistrates. But did the noble and learned lord really suppose that it was possible for the poor peasant, who happened to be wronged, his possessions consisting of two barren acres of land, to bring his appeal before their lordships, incumbered as it must necessarily be with all the expensive accompaniments of lawyers' and solicitors' bills, and parliament fees? But the noble earl (Liverpool) appeared to think that tythes possessed one advantage of a public and political nature-namely, that they brought the clergy into contact with the tenant of the soil. But what sort of contact was it a forced or a voluntary one? To him (lord Ellenborough) it appeared to be much the same species of contact as that of the person beating, with the person beaten, with a stick. His own opinion as to tythes was this: that the clergyman, in future, ought to have all that he has at any time had, in the way of tythe; all that he could, in short, possibly have. Whatever the clergyman might have taken, on an average of the last ten years, he ought to take now and his future tythes ought to bear the same proportion to the increasing produce of the soil, as the tythe he now took bore to its present produce. Whoever went further than this principle, put a limit to the

possibility of effecting a commutation of tythes. It would not be possible to give a sum adequate to the demands of the clergyman, though they might give him a sum equal to what he now received. Unless this commutation, in any bill to be adopted, should be made compulsory on the parties, it would be perfectly ineffectual; at least he (lord Ellenborough) could not conceive a man so blind to his own interest, as that he would voluntarily adopt such a system, if he considered it to be more to his advantage to withstand it. It was not many weeks since several petitions on the subject of commutation of tythes had been presented to their lordships; and the noble duke and marquis who presented them, expressed their readiness to give their aid to any improvement that could be effected in the system. But those noble peers were themselves lay impropriators of tythes to very large amount; and where the proprietor of the soil was also the proprietor of the tythes, their collection was quite impossible. The tythes must merge in the rent; and, accordingly, there were very extensive estates indeed, in some parts of Ireland, in which they had so merged.

The earl of Blessington begged to suggest to the house, that when the property of the church was taken from the Roman catholic occupiers and possessors, it was not conferred on the established church, but granted to various lay impropriators. This appeared to him to found a right in parliament to interfere with the system of tythes.

Lord Darnley deplored the fate of that unfortunate country, which nature seemed to have destined to

be

be happy, but which centuries of misgovernment had involved in almost hopeless misery. A revision of the magistracy of Ireland might be attended with much benefit; but the measure now pending could have the effect only of disgusting those gentlemen who were in the commission. He hoped the appearances, which were now rather against the noble marquis (Wellesley), with respect to his having neglected to co-operate with the government at home, would be effectually removed by explanation. He (lord Darnley) did believe, that until the present lord lieutenant was appointed, it had been the fate of Ireland, that the principal officers under her governors were servilely devoted to the government in England.

Lord Holland said, that the noble baron (lord Ellenborough), who, together with himself, were the only persons on that side of the house unconnected with Ireland, had so ably answered the few objections which had been taken to the original motion, that he (lord Holland) owed their lordships some apology for rising after him. The motion of his noble friend and relative went only to pledge that house to go into an examination of the affairs of Ireland, with a view to better her condition. the noble earl opposite, in a speech, certainly one of the most extraordinary that he had ever heard, had answered his noble friend, by giving their lordships a view of the different states of society which had existed in different countries, in ancient and modern times; and had concluded all these sapient remarks, by another motion to postpone the consideration of the present question: for, speaking in a

1822.

But

parliamentary sense, that was the effect of moving the previous question. It meant as much, as that what was proposed was no doubt a very proper thing to be done, but that this was not a proper time for adopting it. But such a proposition coming from a minister of the crown, meant neither more nor less than this" this may be all very proper; but I cannot agree to it; and I call upon you, from the general manner in which I have conducted myself, to place your whole confidence in the executive government, and to leave them to do just what has been proposed by you to be done." If that were indeed its meaning, the noble earl (Liverpool) had introduced his proposition in a very strange way. He had expressed his admiration (as who that heard the noble marquis would not have also done?) at the manner in which his (lord Holland's) noble friend and relative had brought forward his motion; but then the noble earl proceeded to say, that he was rejoiced to find that it had not been made a party question. After this, however, he (lord Liverpool) had gone on to lay the whole matter on the broad ground of providence, and to make a direct party motion by moving the previous question. As to this or that not being the proper time for its discussion, and as to holding out a promise that it should at some future time be considered, these were subjects on which parliament had already had sufficient experience. (lord Holland) would not ask noble lords to look at what had passed since the union, he would ask them only to look at what had taken place since the last session of parliament. His majesty had scarcely quitted

U

He

quitted the shores of Ireland, when a message came down from the throne, calling on their lordships to suspend the constitution in regard to the kingdom of Ireland, and to adopt strong coercive measures besides. A reluctant consent to these measures was wrung from their lordships; the noble earl opposite told them that it was in the mind of government to do much better things for Ireland, and that this and that plan of relief and improvement were in contemplation. The present government was certainly altogether the most contemplative that ever existed in the world; but the misfortune was, that nothing came of their contemplations. The noble earl had now been contemplating the miseries of Ireland for 22 years, and the only result was, a sort of hint that some time or other he would give his opinion upon them. A noble duke (we believe the duke of Devonshire) whom he (lord Holland) regretted not to see in his place and more particularly as that absence was understood to be caused by indisposition-with all the modesty belonging to his age, but with all that sober judgment and considerate goodness that seemed to be heir-looms in his illustrious family, a few nights since came up to their lordships' table, and said, that notwithstanding all the princely possessions which he derived from them, he was ready to surrender his tythes, and to give his assent to any less burdensome and less objectionable plan, whatever were the personal sacrifice it might occasion to him. The noble earl, as well he might, met that noble duke with well-deserved and handsomely expressed compliments upon this generous

and disinterested offer; and his (lord Holland's) noble friend (the duke of Devonshire) was well satisfied with the complimentary manner in which the noble earl had alluded to him. Now, for his own part, he (lord Holland) hoped that he was not naturally more suspicious than other men; but he had known the noble earl some time, and his suspicions were certainly excited on that evening. So much so, that he told his noble friend, the duke, to beware; that the noble earl had two ways of getting rid of any question which he desired to evade; that one of these was an alarming and terrible way --the noble earl cried "wolf," and talked of the danger of the church, and the perils of the country, the necessity of adhering to ancient principles, and his hopes that noble lords would not allow encroachments to be made, and so forth: that the other way of the noble earl was a smooth one; and that when that was adopted, the noble earl was accustomed to say"I must admit this, indeed, nor can I deny that; but at least some modifications should be made; and I think the house will see the propriety of acceding to them." It was against this smooth mode of evasion, that he (lord Holland) had cautioned his noble friend; and he would say this, that whenever he (lord Holland) had set his heart on carrying any object, he much preferred to hear the lofty and alarming tone of the noble earl than his more placid and gentle strain. A great poet of antiquity, who was said to have understood the female character extremely well--but he (lord Holland) would not name the book, because he was sure that the right reverend

reverend and learned prelates could know nothing about it-that poet had observed, that he never objected to a little scolding, and a little scratching, and a little pulling of his hair at the hands of his mistress, because he knew that softer moments were sure to follow: so he (lord Holland) felt well satisfied with the excited animation of the noble earl, but he dreaded the other tone. The noble lord proceeded to comment on the numerous instances in which his majesty's government had at first pledged themselves never to concede measures which afterwards they brought into parliament and most warmly supported; as in the cases of the bullion question-the invasion of the inviolable sinking fund the admission of Roman catholics to commands in the army

and navy.

It was in vain for the noble earl to say, that under any system of government at all resembling that which now prevailed in it, Ireland would do better. To disguise the fatal mismanagement which had reduced Ireland to what she now was, the noble earl was compelled to digress in his speech to examples of the most extraordinary states of society imaginable-to the Helots of Sparta-to the slaves at Rome, and to the slaves in the United States of America. The speech of the noble earl was more directed against reform than appli

cable to the present question. The noble lord (Holland) then proceeded to remark on the total absence of analogy between the cases of Scotland and Ireland; to the misery of Ireland under a system of tythes paid to the ministers of a religion foreign from her own; and to the prosperity of Scotland immediately subsequent to the abolition of episcopacy, and the extinction of tythes, formerly payable by the presbytery to ministers of the English church. The noble lord concluded his speech by reminding the house, that if ever the circumstances of Ireland should render it necessary to propose the repeal of the union, he should be justified in those principles upon which he had formerly opposed that measure; and, still contending, that where the spirit and energies of the two nations, their habits, laws, and their government, could not be assimilated, the one must be the victim of the other-a lifeless corpse attached to a living body; he should again recur to the lines he had on that former occasion quoted

"Mortua quin etiam jungebat corpora vivis, Componens manibusque manus, atque oribus

ora.'

H°

OUSE of Lords, June 19.Lord Ellenborough moved the order of the day for further proceedings on the marriage act amendment bill.

The discussion in the committee was accordingly resumed.

The archbishop of Canterbury rose to state his objection to the bill. It was the business of the house to impose all the protection the human mind could devise with a view to the security of marriage. It was their duty to prevent clandestine marriages, but when marriage was once solemnized, the law should prevent its being dissolved. The bill before the house did not go to that extent, and the right reverend prelate therefore opposed it. Marriage, in the course of debate, had been called a civil contract. It certainly was a civil contract, sanctioned by religion. It was a solemn contract; a religious ceremony, performed in the house of God by a minister of the gospel.

Lord Ellenborough said, he heard with great satisfaction the 'opinion of the most reverend prelate, yet he could not consent to give up the principle of the bill. Since the debate of last night, he understood a noble and learned lord was prepared to offer clauses

for the consideration of the house, which would apply to the marriage of minors. He should, under these circumstances, withdraw his amendments.

The archbishop of York concurred in the opinion expressed by the archbishop of Canterbury.

The earl of Liverpool agreed in what had been said by the right reverend prelates, namely, that where a marriage had taken place, there should be no nullity. He then proposed, that the clauses of his noble and learned friend should be delivered in and reprinted with the bill, for the purpose of being recommitted.

The lord chancellor said, the great object they all had in view was that of letting persons, who had undergone the ceremony of marriage, know whether they were married or not. The clauses of the bill then under discussion could not be adopted. It was certainly most desirable that persons should know that, after the ceremony of marriage had taken place, it could not be dissolved.

Lord Redesdale proposed, that the consent of persons to be married should be expressed in writing, stating that they were 21 years of age. The statement to be attested by persons not related to the par