of the character of that Learned Gentleman, and was persuaded he would come forward as soon as circumstances would permit him. His Lordship observed, he would not then follow the Rev. Prelate who opened the discussion, through his detailed observations, as probably another oppertunity would present tself. The LORD CHANCELLOR wished it to be distinctly understood, that he grounded his preference to the longer term, only because it afforded a better chance of something conclusive in the interval. Lord ALVANLEY took occasion to observe, that if the general bill should be so far delayed this session as not to be brought up until the beginning of July, he should hold it his duty to oppose it; and he perfectly agreed in what had been so ably stated by a Noble Lord (Grenville), towards the end of the last session, respecting the necessity of having a full attendance, particularly of the Rev. Bench, in the discussion of the subject in question. House, as therein it would, most probably, have a more free and full discussion. The LORD CHANCELLOR, after shortly no. ticing what had transpired on the subject of non-attendance and absence from town, ob. served, that he saw no objection to the bill originating in that House; but in all probability, a bill so originating, would require a very full second discussion, in consequence of the alterations which would most likely be made in it by the other House; and particularly with respect to the subject of cu rates, he observed, it would be found rather difficult to make a provision for them in that House. Lord ELLENBOROUGH delivered his opi nions on the general subject at some length. He was unfavourable to the practice of suspension-a subject which was never warranted, save by considerations of public necessity.— He took occasion to pronounce a splendid panegyric on the character and talents of the Right Hon. and Learned Gent. (Sir W. Scott), so often alluded to in the course of the discussion. He adverted to the great difficulties Lord AUCKLAND delivered his sentiments as well as the importance of framing legison the question at some length: he noticed lative provisions to remedy the evils comthe improper effect of such bills of suspension, plained of; but though they could not do all which in some measure may be said to leave the good they wished, they should do all the that part of the community without law. good they could: they should, as far as in them He argued in favour of a general amending lay, ameliorate the statute of Henry VIII. by a bil!, and which, among other good effects, general bill. The Noble Lord adverted to a would go to ameliorate the condition of the variety of provisions which could in such a poorer orders of the clergy. With respect measure be introduced with the most salutary to shortening the term, the other House, in effect. He alluded to certain descriptions of the view of its pecuniary operation, would, the clergy who he thought should not be on that account, be induced to reject the exempted from residence on pleas which were bill. Adverting to the circumstance of a at present held as admissible. The considergeneral amending bill, the Noble Lord ex-ation of how the Commons may afterwards pressed his opinion that such a measure might very properly originate in that House; and he alluded to certain regulations, which, in such a legislative provision, would be attended with the most salutary effects. In allusion to what had been said of the state of the attendance in that House, particularly towards the close of a session, his Lordship made ome admirable philosophical remarks on the nature and propensities of man, the almost irresistible attractions of rural retirement or occupations at certain seasons of the year, with a view to palliate that occasional, and sometimes frequent secession from parliamentary attendance, at the seasons of the year alluded to. Lord ALVANLEY, in explanation, observed, rather jocosely, that were the Noble Lord's ideas of green fields, &c. set up as a plea for the non-attendance of legislators, there ought to be a sort of qui tam proceedings instituted on the occasion. With respect to the bill so frequently alluded to, for his part, Le rather preferred its originating in that treat the bill, should not prevent them from originating the measure in that House, in which work he would be most happy to assist, as far as the very little leisure his official duty afforded him. Lord PELHAM delivered his sentiments on the occasion, which in a great degree seemed to tally with those of his Noble Friend on the Woolsack. He observed it would be im. proper to act on the presumption of what may be the intention of any individual to propose. He entertained no objection to a bill of the description alluded to originating in that House: on the contrary, he seemed to think it the better place, particularly with a reference to the Bench of Bishops; and in the discussion of the measure he would cheerfully assist to the utmost of his power. The BISHOP of DURHAM spoke shortly in explanation, as did The BISHOP of ST. ASAPH, in the course of which he deprecated the effects of misapprehension, and observed, it was proper it should be understood, that the statute of Henry VIII. instead of diminishing the power of the ecclesiastical courts, went in furtherance of the old law of residence. After some further observations, the Rev. Prelate, the Bishop of Rochester, having consented to withdraw his amendment, the bill went through the committee, and the report was ordered to be received next day. HOUSE OF LORDS. Friday, April 1. (See Minutes, p. 667.) [CLERGY NON-RESIDENCE.]-The order of the day being read for receiving the report of the clergy residence bill, The Earl of CARLISLE rose, and said, he had a few observations to make connected with the bill, which might be as formally offered on the present occasion as on any other stage of the bill. The Noble Earl then launched into a variety of observations, chiefly applying to the general subject. He declared his aversion to suspension bills in general, as they tended, so far as their operation applied, to leave the community without law, and to remove those landmarks which the wisdom of our ancestors had carefully established. The subject to which the bill related, was undoubtedly one of considerable importance; and it was generally admitted that something was necessary to be done to remedy the inconveniences and grievances complained of. On such an occasion the Noble Earl said their Lordships should depend upon themselves principally. It was improper to rely, in a case of such magnitude, on the exertions of any single individual, however learned or appropriately qualified: notwithstanding which, he was inclined to entertain little hopes of seeing an efficacious measure brought forward in that House. In framing a general bill, whenever it should be undertaken, there was one consideration which forcibly struck him as necessary, in order to render the measure complete and effectual; namely, an adequate provision not only for the poorer curates, but for some of the other inferior orders of the clergy, who were unhappily in very necessitous circumstances. Of the former, such instances of distress and misery could be detailed as would make their Lordships' hearts ache. Respecting this provision, he thought that it should come out of the public purse. His Lordship enforced these leading ideas by several relevant observations, in the course of which he said, there were persons in that House fraught with ecclesiastical and legal information, who were fully competent to the undertaking alluded to. Lord ARDEN begged leave to offer a few observations on the present occasion; he ex pressed his surprise, that after what they had all heard in debate last night, any observation should be thrown out expressive of a degree of despair that the subject in question would not be effectually taken up, and originated in that House. What transpired in the discussion of last night, was of considerable importance; it would, he was confident, be productive of much benefit, and for his own part, it made a deep impression on his mind. He must deprecate all objections to bills ori ginating in that House, with a reference to what might be their probable fate in the House of Commons. To act upon such a principle would be something like a standing in awe of the other House, and would in a certain degree tend to render the House, instead of its being, as it incontestably was, an efficient and component branch of the Legislature, a mere cipher in the constitution of the country. Though he thought and felt in this manner for the estimation, on constitutional grounds, of a House of which he had not long had the high honour to be a Member, yet he duly respected the constitutional privileges of the House of Commons, in which he had the honour to sit many years. After what had passed last night, he entertained no fears of an efficient measure originating in that House, which he was inclined to wish it should. The Rt. Rev. the Bishops formed a part of that House, to whose province the subject in question more particularly belonged; and besides these there were several Noble and Learned Lords every way adequate to the task; among these he could not help especially regarding one, then in his place (Lord Ellenborough), whose opinions seemed to make such an impression on their Lordships yesterday, and from the talents and information which he displayed, he evinced himself peculiarly well calculated for the task. He was aware of the important and various official duties of that Learned Lord, yet he could not avoid expressing his hope that his Lordship would come forward and give as much of his precious time as he conveniently could to the subject. Were the Noble and Learned Lord to undertake it, he entertained the most confident hopes of a salutary and effectual measure being the result; and he doubted not, that were a bill sent down from that House to the Commons, they would treat it with the most respectful attention, and contribute every thing in their power towards rendering the measure effectual, consistent with their own peculiar privileges. Lord AUCKLAND agreed with the Noble Lord as to the general propriety and good effect of a measure of this kind originating in that House; and further, he thought their Lordships should, on the present occasion, chiefly hely on their own exertions. Did they rely solely on the other House, or rather on the exertions of any single individual, one of these results would, he thought, be the to assist on such occasions, to the extent of consequence: either that no bill would be their respective abilities. sent up to them this session, or, that it would be sent up at so late a period, that their Lordships would be unable to collect in sufficient numbers, fully and duly to discuss it. For his own part, he was not fond of giving pledges, but so deeply was he impressed with the consideration that something should be done in the affair, he would say thus far, and he begged to be rightly understood, that if no bill should be sent up to them on the subject, or no other Noble Lord came forward, at an early period after the ensuing recess he should himself, notwithstanding the importance of his official avocations, and however inadequate he might be in some parts of them, undertake it, so far as to commit his ideas on the subject to paper, and lay them before the House in the shape of a bill. He should certainly give his best attention to the subject, and what he should propose would be the result. He doubted not when he had gone so far, what he should crudely and indigestedly lay before the House would be attentively considered and discussed by their Lordships, among whom many men more competent than himself were to be found. He should have in view, in what he should propose, two principles, which he thought of the highest importance; first, that the church should be left to govern itself, and, secondly, to keep the principle of residence in view, so far as to secure to parishes a due care and attention, with as little hardship or inconvenience to individuals as was practicable. The LORD CHANCELLOR called the attention of the House to the precise nature of the question before them, which was, whether it would agree to a single amendment made in the title of the bill, and only going to correct an inaccuracy with respect to the dates as originally expressed? Their Lordships would judge how far what had been said was applicable to that question. However, what had transpired induced him to offer a very few observations. With respect to making pledges, he would remind any individual Peer of the extent, importance, and difficulties of the task to be undertaken, and he would beg leave particularly to address himself to the Noble and Learned Lord who seemed alluded to by the Noble Lord who spoke second in the debate, and bring to his consideration the duties of his official station: these were so various, so important, so onerous and pressing, as perhaps not to afford him sufficient time to pay the necessary degree of attention to the subject. For his own part, his official duties were such as entirely to disable him from undertaking the task; but whenever the bill should come before that House, he would of course assist in its discussion, and in bringing it to maturity to the utmost of his power: indeed it was the bounden duty of all their Lords.ips | Lord ELLENBOROUGH expressed his coincidence with what fell from the Noble and Learned Lord. He was fully aware how much of his time was necessarily engrossed by due attention to his official duties, and such considerations should influence, with respect to his entering into a pledge for the performance of any thing that might clash or interfere with them. Indeed, generally speaking, he was not fond of pledging himself, or of making promises on such occasions; he had rather come forward and act where it was practicable, than make any promise at all. He was also as fully aware of the extent and importance of the subject in question, which he seemed to think admitted of two views, the greater and the less. His Lordship took occasion to panegyrize the talents and extensive information of the Rt. Hon. and Learned Gent. who had already come forward on the occasion; and in better hands, he observed, the subject could not be placed. However, with respect to the less or limited view of the subject, he did not see that degree of difficulty in it which some Noble Lords seemed to conceive-he meant the question of resi dence. To this point he had lately given some hours close consideration, and the result was, in his opinion, that the difficulties of it in a great degree may be obviated. With regard to the greater and more comprehensive view of the subject, he seemed to think himself inadequate to the task, even were there any prospect of his important judicial avocations affording him any leisure. Lord ALVANLEY, in the course of his ob servations, remarked, that he never could entertain any doubts of the propriety of the bill originating in that House; he only meant to express his apprehension that the Commons would never agree to any provision for the inferior order of the clergy, out of the public purse, in the shape of a bill from that House. He then observed as to the tendency of what had already been done in the affair, and seemed of opinion that something should be done with respect to depending actions, even on grounds of justice; in regard to those which might arise hereafter, it would naturally be matter of future consideration. The question was then put, and the report agreed to by their Lordships. HOUSE OF LORDS. Monday, April 4.-(See Minutes, p. 668.) [MILITIA OFFICERS' BILL.]-The order of the day being read for their Lordships going into a committee on the militia officers' bill, and the question being put, Earl ROMNEY rose, and expressed his senti- ten months ago. He would prefer the supments upon the subject of the militia at some pression of the militia to its remaining in its len. th. He adverted to the measures lately present altered and degraded state. He exadopted with respect to the militia, particu- patiated on the constitutional evils of removlarly those which took place last year. Of ing the necessity of qualifications, which he the latter he expressed his disapprobation, thought was done to bring the militia more considering them at best but as unnecessary, into the power of the Minister. He depre in many instances injurious, and generally dis- cated the practice of sending the militia out gusting to the constitutional officers of the of the country, and which was followed up, old militia. The addition of the three cap-he observed, with the more injurious measure tains to each corps clearly increased the diffi- of rendering it, in fact, a mere drill for the culty experienced by the Lord Lieutenants in regiments of the line. meeting with qualified officers. The measures of Ministers with respect to the militia were such as must disgust the commanders of mi- | litia regiments, and induce them to retire. With respect to himself, he thought the militia reduced to that situation, that, under all circumstances, its continuance was no longer desirable. If any Lord should concur with him, he could almost himself move for the repeal of the militia laws, when the army could go on as before the establishment of the militia. The Duke of CUMBERLAND observed, he ought to apologize to their Lordships for thus obtruding himself (two or three Peers having risen at the same time, but immediately gave way to his Royal Highness), when there were so many other Peers better qualified than he was to give an opinion upon the subject; but he assured the committee he should not detain them many minutes. With respect to the clause before them, and which was so strongly objected to, he observed, the effect of it was merely to enable the Lord Lieutenants to officer the militia corps, in cases of vacancy, by military men. The objections, however, to this regulation were made in the way of an apparent insinuation that such would be a breach of the constitution. Did he view the operation of the clause in that light, he assured their Lordships he would be the last in that House to support it: but he considered the measure very differently. In the first instance, the Lord Lieutenants were required to fill up with qualified officers according to the old regulations; nay more, the provisions of the bill before the committee went to strengthen the established principle of the old militia, inasmuch as it enabled the Lord Lieutenants to look for qualified officers in other counties than those to which their corps belonged, which they were not previThe House then resolved into a committee, ously authorized to do. This he considered Lord Walsingham in the Chair.-When the as a constitutional advantage, as it could not clause objected to, on a former discussion, by be denied but that a gentleman of landed procertain Peers, namely, that authorizing the perty in Yorkshire, and one of landed proservice, and settling the rank of officers un-perty in Wiltshire, had the same general inqualified by the old militia laws, was read, some explanatory conversation took place in the first instance between Lords Radnor, Hobart, and his Royal Highness the Duke of Cumberland. Marquis TOWNSHEND spoke shortly in answer to what fell from the Noble Earl. He differed entirely from him with respect to the effect of the measures adopted by Government in regard to the militia, deeming them neither degrading nor injurious. He deprecated all ideas of suppressing the militia, and seemed surprised at hearing such an idea started, particularly at a period when the power of France was at such an alarming height. The militia he considered as necessary for the home defence, and, with a view to render the troops of the line the more completely disposable, independent of offensive operations, a large disposable force would always be necessary, particularly for the defence of our colonial possessions. terest in defending the country. He enter tained no doubts of qualified officers coming forward in its defence; and must deprecate every idea of disbanding the militia, that established constitutional force. The proposed measure he regarded as one dictated by neThe Earl of CARNARVON expressed his hos- cessity, for it was obvious the militia could tility to the clause at some length. He as- not be brought into action, or marched, withserted, that, did the committee agree to the out officers. He entertained the highest posclause, a great sacrifice would be made with-sible respect for the militia, yet he must think out any reasons being assigned, and, in fact, on the bare requisition of the Minister. He recapitulated several of his former observations respecting the original establishment of the militia as a constitutional defensive force, and alluded to certain points of the late conduct of Ministers, which he said were in direct contradiction to their declarations only the introduction of military men would be of service. Some stress was laid by a Noble Lord on the circumstance of militia-men being sent abroad: his way of putting the case, however, was not very correct; the army was in want of men, at the time, for a very particular and important occasion, on which a cer[tain number of militia-men were authorized by Parliament to enter into the regiments of Ireland to this, volunteered their services to the line, did they choose it, as volunteers, assist them. Such a proceeding was not an as the militia corps could not constitutionally infringement of the constitution, and wicked be sent out of the country; for, with respect indeed would Ministers have been, did they to Ireland, he must consider it, especially refuse such offers. With respect to the Union, since the Union, as identified with this, and no man could possibly approve that wishedas forming but one country. He hoped the for consummation more than himself. But to militia of both parts of the United Kingdom render it fully effectual, or better than a parchwould be of reciprocal service. On these ge- ment record, the two countries should assimineral grounds he should give his full support late in every thing. He even thought there to the bill. should be a clause in the present bill for their service in Ireland, as it is already done with regard to Scotland. He knew not what difference there was between those countries, equally united to England, unless it was that the one required a voyage of about sixty miles to reach it. Were the services of the militia limited, according to the ideas of the Noble Lords, to their respective counties, it may be a good police institution, but could never be an efficient military force. Earl ROMNEY, in reply to part of what had fallen from the Royal Duke, expressed his regret at feeling himself obliged to differ even on the slightest point from his Royal Highness; but he was of opinion, that Ireland was very differently circumstanced from Great Britain in regard to its militia. With respect to the idea of abrogating the militia force, he certainly could not entertain it, as applying to the present period, or in the present circumstances of the country, but as a measure, under the consideration he had alluded to, desirable at a future period. Lord REDESDALE defended the conduct of Government with respect to the militia, and pointed out to the committee the essential difference between the constitution of the militia force as a permanent peace establishment, and as formed for purposes of war. The Earl of WESTMORELAND followed on The Earl of RADNOR, in reply to the last speaker, enforced some of his former objec tions, and contended that the original compact made with the militia had been violated. The Duke of CUMBERLAND protested against the idea that the militia were drafted into the regiments of the line; the case was very different, the act only enabled them to turn out as volunteers. The Earl of CARNARVON spoke at some length in explanation. the same ground, and defended the militia as constituted at present, in which form it rendered the most essential and glorious services The Earl of LIMERICK, in reply to an obto this country. He observed, one great ad-servation of the last speaker, observed, that vantage derivable from the militia was, that it the officers of the militia in Ireland, with the superseded the necessity of having recourse exception of the colonels, were not appointed to a foreign service for defensive purposes. by the Crown. The principle upon which the clause objected to proceeded, was by no means new in the militia system; there were acts of Parliament which gave a suspending power with respect to a proof of qualification. He thought it better, as now proposed, to vest the Lord Lieutenants with a direct power in case of necessity; and he could not help observing, that the ideas suggested by the Noble Lords opposite, was rather an odd way of shewing their friendship for the militia. Lord BOLTON approved of the present measure, but observed, he, as one of those officers authorized to act by the bill, should not feel himself justified in accepting the offers of unqualified officers, except he should not be able to meet with officers qualified according to the former regulations; of which, however, his Lordship seemed to think there was no danger. The Earl of LIMERICK Could not refrain The Marquis of SLIGO, adverting to the from making a very few observations on the constitution of the militia of Ireland, expresent subject. He observed, that the cir- plained, that the officers there were appointed cumstance of the English militia serving in in the same way as in this country. He expaIreland was noticed by certain Noble Lords in tiated on the firm attachment of the Irish in such a way, as if those troops were compelled general to Great Britain, and noticed that re by Government to go thither against their incli-markable expression of the national wish at nations: that, however, was very far from being the case; the militia corps in this country felt for the situation of their loyal brethren in that country, and, with a zeal and alacrity which reflected eternal honour on them, and would lastingly attach the loyal inhabitants of the famous meeting of Dungannon-“ Let us share the liberties of the British Isle!" His Lordship expressed his heart-felt satisfaction at what had fallen from the Royal Duke respecting the reciprocal services of the militia of Great Britain and Ireland, |